- Sean Norling Artistic expression isn't always tied to the making of money.
The vilaj kid dancing to bird song in the morning = artist
The grandmother making the family secret soup with herbs from the garden = artist.
There is more to art than making money for sure.- Wells Tao Wow thanks for that genuine insight. But clearly you are missing the context of what the question was, the question was Can you name one artists that isn't a capitalist? It's interesting isn't it that you haven't really done that. You've gone, hey I don't care about money or fame, or what ever so that means I'm not part of the scene. Not a capitalist. Those people are corrupt, and perpetuate the conditions of oppression, the four heads of hydra, Racism, Sexism, Ageism and classism. And you or someone else will comment on how interesting some other point is, usually a witty arty observation, just to prove your original authority on this matter, how you've really thought it through, at least to a life style and culture. Like basically who does this dude think he is telling me I'm a capitalist, who the fuck does he think he is? Well I Know what I am I'm telling you, I not a capitalist, my economy isn't pretending not to perpetuate the stats quo with my pose as a green strike lefty strike socialist strike creative, strike carer, strike ecologist, strike envirometalks, spritualists, you are still a capitalist. And you are by the simple and brutal fact that you DO NOT differentiate your economy from capitalism. If you practice democracy in your relationship, if you share your wealth equally and choose how to spend your relationships profit using democracy, then you are a democratic socialist in a co-op. Promote this and you leave capitalism. And I can and others will be able to see you. And together we will create a socialist community that can see one another in public, identify each other in the same way organic produce and infrastructure separates itself from other forms of food. We can trade with each other in the market place and take back our profits to each others socialists dens. Welfare is not capitalist. I am a public welfare artist, for now. I am a solo father of 50% of two youngish children trying to create several businesses, Mental and Physical Health Birth Trainer for Men (and woman too). Art School of Less Fear, Socialists, tutor, Relationship Economic’s - How to leave capitalism, now -Educational seminars and Public presentations. You can look at me as someone who was signed on into democracy almost from birth. they ask you, they asked me to sign my children as part of the legalising the name of your child process. You are actually given money in this transaction. I can’t remember the exact reasons, but the combination is incredibly attractive to the point I worry about how capitalism would surly be more situated to offer more money to potential members, since it operates so well with stealth silence and default backdrop authority. I was surprisingly classically poor and quite desperate, out of legitimate work, lacking in socials legitimacy. My last major public show being publicly cancelled and made to look like it was my fault, After I had given up going straight to do the show, as a major come back move and a real risk psychologically. With a child just born, me trying to get out of my rage anger and violence problems, not wanting to pass them on, wanting them to end for me. I was taught violence. Took me eight years of therapy. and twenty years before that banging my head against a wall. It’s with a great deal of relief to know that that kind of world for me is over. I have escaped, been 12 months this month, that something relieved itself of my whole being and just lifted off. Four months before that I had to ask my parents to not contact me or have anything more to do with me. I had had the sudden and shocking revelation that I was under the delusion that I was working for them. That my art work, was part of some family business that we were all aware of. My father is an incredible artist, who as a town planner has worked mostly in so called developing countries for spooky global banksters. But his methodology of practice was meticulous consensus democracy where he would use the bad guys money and engage with huge hui for years, preparing the indigenous society for the coming battle that he was meant to be laying the ground works for, he was just not in the way that was expected of him. And this got him to have a kind of reputation where he was used by radicals in the administrations of these cultures, that could use him, I guess as a kind of hit man, to radicalise the locals to defend themselves from the multinationals. Protect their assets as global capitalism comes for the late raid. Strengthen traditions that need to live and engage in developments which are openly decided upon. Very impressive stuff. And yet no coffee table book. He’d love it, He’s recorded all of it, he’s also a top shelve photo journalist. I grew up with a stone slate pool table and a dark room. Not to mention the african carvings, goat skin shields, hand made spears and knives. A 20 foot python skin across the spiral stair case. So yeah , art aristocracy, you the welfared of New Zealand. The Superanuant astronauts. Those that value freedom from commercial constraints as dictated by capitalism and recognise their democratic right to leave the capitalist market and toil in the fields of volunteer democratic culture. As manifestations of freedom. Not as a dream or a perfect goal. But one realised and recognised as already existing. Just need to change your attitude. If you can recognise the 250 billion spent by capitalism on it’s campaign to dominate your life, You can appreciate how powerful my pitch is, given I exist as a democratic socialist, you are reading my virus pitch right now. And all I can do is watch you try to hang yourself with effort to resist the logic. Watch you dangle and twirl helpless turning and twisting very much alive and stuck, snared. But your not, that is a defence built into you by capitalism a story to make you seem like panic is the way to fein your way out of facing the obvious. It’s ok. I’m done. You’r free to go.
- Sean Norling Wow, man thank you for that painfully long and condescending response. My point was actually really simple. We take for granted the artistry that is all around us. It doesn't have to hang on a wall or be some kind of critical discourse . Then you make it about me? You told me I was a capitalist? No. I said I wasn't a capitalist? No. I won't bother answering your shit-posts again tbh, because I'd be worried your narcissistic head would pop with all that shit in there.
- Wells Tao you take for granted the artistry around you. Stop using the royal we. And yeah everything is art, and since I never knew you how can you be missed. arrivederci. 4,000 or so 'friends' to go...
- Martin Rumsby Actually, probably any number of American avant-garde filmmakers before 1970. Although I do not know his specific circumstances I guess that Christopher Maclaine would probably meet you criteria. A true outsider and 'genuine madman.'
- Wells Tao woopde doo, Sorry but if you don't know that their economy is something other than capitalism, then you can explain to me how that isn't just perpetuating the default of capitalism, day in day out 24/7 12 months a year etc etc.. go on. Have a go.
- Martin Rumsby Well, you would have to know about Maclaine first .... unknown in NZ. Probably the first exemplar of Beat culture - is his avant-garde film: The End (1953) - an almost perfect cinematic expression of the Beat ethos, but before Beat (one could maybe say…See More
- Wells Tao all banal boring capitalists. Each and everyone of them. Sad eh?
- Martin Rumsby Wells Tao while capitalism is a problem not all capitalists are bad. In NZ, I think that the dominant problem is the academisation and institutionalization (corporatism) of media arts. This mitigates against independent artists such as Brent Hayward who literally had to sell his arse on k road to make his work and others, such as Kathy Kathryn Dudding who had to labour away in menial jobs. Not so the highly paid arts academic or public servant who cares not a whit for independent work.
- Wells Tao Martin Rumsby aw pull my heart stings, all a flutter, I never said sir that all capitalists are bad now, don't go into a death spin, already... some of my best mates are capitalists and that's no lie. But you go ahead with your list of hero's, lots of them are those democratic volunteers you can find doing their work on this or that public purse.
- Martin Rumsby Wells Tao Well, I don't know that. I do know that they all lived in a capitalist society, many living and working at the very edge of or even outside of that society. Certainly, there have been American avant-garde filmmakers who were able to survive by working for the film industry - Pat O'Neill and Jordon Belson spring to mind, as does the actor Dean Stockwell. Bruce Conner had a dealer gallery who he got offside with by stamping his signature on his work with a rubber stamp and therefore, in a way, refusing to commodify his work. I think his dealer dropped him for that and his potentially great career as a visual artist went down the tubes there. (Conner also shot the graveyard sequence in New Orleans for the film Easy Rider and did light shows for rock bands but I have no idea how much money he made from such activities. Let us say themm the Conner actively attempted to subvert the capitalist commodification, marketing and sale of his work to such an extent that he became unmarketable as an artist).
- Martin Rumsby Wells Tao Not much public purse in the USA and none for me in NZ either. They are not my heroes - I just made a serious study of the genre because it was the area that I wanted to work in. I think it is good for artists to study their predecessors, though this does not mean that one should slavishly follow them.
- Wells Tao So you can't collect super here in NZ? That sucks. Yes I see myself as the perpetual student. Who is also as a matter of fact a Master. I like to call on my degree as if it really does have power for me. I like to challenge shit with it.
- Wells Tao I'm a qualified agent of the state mate, watch out, charged with the duty of visible maintenance of the standards. Took me ten years.
- Martin Rumsby Well yes, once we give up learning and being open to such then we are most likely doomed. My concerns at this time are about the future or viability of western culture and how and where we may move forward. I am locating my search in S E Asia.
Saturday, May 16, 2020
since I never knew you how can you be missed
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